I wish that the incident that I described in the last post was the only trouble I was having in the psychoanalytic psychotherapy class. It isn’t. I had another run in about a clinical issue. I recieved such a bad and unprofessional reaction to something that I presented that I came home and decided that I will not be doing any further prevsnting in the supervision group.
When I told Igor he described the incident as “sadisistic”. If I could tell you what it was you would agree with him. Igor encouraged me to tell the supervisor my feelings about the incident and I am so glad he did. Conversely, as Igor knows the players in this drama, he most definitely did not advise me to confront the memory-phobic instructors. I did, however, call the chair of the program and tell her about the troubles I have had with the envious-amnesiacs. The chair was gracious and even apologetic—and she seemed eager for me to write all that I had shared with her in my course evaluation., “this is the kind of thing we want to know when planning for next year.”
When I contacted the supervisor I initially chickened out and said via email: “Just FYI:, I will not be presenting in supervision anymore.” The instructor wrote back immediately and said , in essence, “Of course. You should only do what is best for you. That said, is there anything I should know about. Do you need to process anything that happened?” I wrote back and said, “Well now that you mention it…” and then I told him how much I had enjoyed the supervision and how I had valued what I had gotten out of learning about his theoretical lens of perspective but that something had happened( I’m not at liberty to share the details with you of what happened) but I did tell him what happened and why I would be doing no further presenting. As soon as I sent him the email I felt both terrified and liberated. Why terrified? I was afraid of getting in trouble. I thought he would be defensive and deny the incident. Minutes later I got back an email in which the supervisor took complete blame for the incident and he sincerely apologized. His reaction felt honest and sincere and I was wonderfully surprised and felt something close to vindicated and acknowledged. I love it when people are mature, responsible and accountable.
I am not sure why I am telling you all this except that as this first quarter is almost over and the second quarter is scheduled to begin in January—and that I am feeling not a little ambivalent. I loved the class on transference and counter-transfernce. The material was fascinating. The teachers were engaging and well prepared—and I learned a lot. The other class, the class on the analytic frame was not. At best, the teachers seemed to be winging it. Truly, I think , without notes, I could have given a better class on the topic. And the supervision portion of the class was mixed( good and bad). So I am paying $650 a quarter for a class that I only enjoy 1/3 of the time. I an wondering what next quarter will be like. I gave igor the instructor list for the winter quarter. He thinks 2/3 of the instructors will be good. He doesn’t like who I have for supervision. He really doesn’t like the guy. He even used words like “terrible”, “torture”,”you will be made to feel wrong” and “you don’t need that”. Speaking of Igor, I resent like crazy how much of the last eight weeks of my therapy have been spent talking about this class.
I just don’t know what to do. I am wondering if I would be better off hiring a supervisor on my own( one I actually like and respect and trust) and reading the class material on my own( I have the reader for the rest of the year, so I do have that option). However, it is hard to stay motivated to keep up with the reading without having the class to keep me on task. I find that option of dropping out to be a disappointing one. All of this feels pretty disapointing. Only, as I said before, I have learned a whole lot in this class. And I hate quitting.
When I think about quiting this class I think of my father. My father was big on calling me a quitter. I think because I quit taking guitar lessons when I was twelve( He NEVER got over it. My mother neither. My mother still brings it up. That infamous guitar lesson quitting is what got me the identity as a quitter). But I finished college, grad schools, post-grad training and my dad is dead. How much do I have to do to prove to him that I am a non-quitter before I can quit something that doesn’t work for me? And did I mention that he is dead?
I am not one to ask for a lot of advice but I guess I wonder what you would do if you were in my Tory Burch leopard pumps? Suggestions of spending the money I would have spent on the class on a Prada bag are welcome and encouraged. So should I stay or should I go? For the record, I know that I sound like I am really wanting to drop the class but I LOVE learning and I have, as I mentioned before, learned a lot in this class. That is why( and the whole “I am not allowed to quit because that would make me a quitter” thing) this decision isn’t easy.
Surely if you can do it on your own with your choice of supervisor, which you will enjoy, then to put yourself through a class with a supervisor, who Igor says is terrible, IS NOT QUITTING!!!
Why make something you love into something that you will stress about going to?
Will that not defeat the purpose of the whole thing?
So go but don’t quit!!!!!!!!
Julienne: I can’t thank you, and everyone who responded to this post, enough. I like your questions, “Why make something you love into something that you will stress about going to?” and I very much like your distinction about leaving is not quitting. Thank you for that.
Well…
You already know my thoughts on “quitting.” And if you don’t remember them, just look up “The Art of Quitting,” laugh and adapt it to your needs as required.
With respect to the course itself:
1. Why did you enroll in it?
2. What did you anticipate deriving from it?
3. Are you getting what you wanted out of the course? (Duh…)
4. Do you “need” the current course to achieve your future goals?
I have a personal attitude about schooling that I call “The Wire Coat Hanger Theory of Education”:
What you get in school(s) for the most part is the wire coat hanger version of knowledge served up by those who make a living teaching and may, or may not, love doing so.
If you want the puffy, satin, embroidered coat hanger with plastic-covered hooks, you have to go get it for yourself. It is possible that you should submit a proposal to create and teach a class on the same material to show them what the good one should look like.
However, if you are not of a mind to do so, you either have to accept the utilitarian wire one, with which the insecure teachers are currently beating you, OR stop subjecting yourself to their substandard drivel and diverge onto the path less-traveled––wherever it may lead.
25¢ please.
BTW, please get back to me when you have read Cushman’s opinion of psycho-industrial complex…
I owe you MUCH more than 25 cents. I think your answer is more of the $250 variety. I love this idea of education as a hanger. This, my friend, is fascinating and the kind of thing that should be published. I remember when I started grad school and feeling sure that it was going to be the Platonic ideal of hangerdom. Sadly it wasn’t. It was great. But it was no plush/satin hanger.
I do think that the wire hanger learning experience can be a good frame for the custom hanger.
I will of course let you know when I have read Cushman.
Thanks, dear Pliers!
It is so nice of you to ask for the opinion of your readers! It feels clearly that you love to learn and are not a quitter. But my very humble opinion is that you should not willingly ‘buy’ an unpleasant experience. There are better uses for your time, money, not to mention soul. Why get hurt, frustrated, confused, etc., AND pay for it? Especially when there are other options, like you yourself already identified?
I know that I have incredible, smart and insightful readers—-and I am so very lucky to have such wonderful friends/readers to turn to for advice, thoughts and feedback. I so appreciate your generous feedback. I do, I will admit, resent having to pay for being shamed. I have gotten it for free in the past.;-)
Ok, here is my two cents worth. What in the end is most beneficial for you. If you truly desire the end prize from this experience; ask yourself if you can ignore the asses and tolerate it until the end. If it really doesn’t matter professionally if you finish, then why subject yourself to their crap. You are not a quitter, ,you are taking care of yourself. If you will really benefit from completion, then turn the asses off and plow through. But only if you can do it without harm to yourself. Best of luck, just wonder why some losers have to make others feel bad.
You asked a lot of great questions. I don’t think it is the *end* that I want. I want to learn. I want to expand my knowledge of psychoanalytic theory and I have already done that. Just one quarter and I have learned so much. I am so grateful for all I learned. And I feel sure I would learn more if I stayed. But, as you say, I will also have to subject myself to crap. I also feel stronger for standing up for myself and saying no to what doesn’t fit. All and all it has been a valuable learning experience( even the bad bits). Thanks so much, Julianne. You really got me thinking.
Dear Bella Belette, I don’t understand all the details or implications of your quitting and staying, but I can say that when you were describing the “incident” and the successive ripercussions I felt myself cringe. Life is too short to put up with bullies, dear Belette. You’re a very bright, lovely and intelligent lady. Do you really need to deal with those morons…Many hugs. Ciao. A.
Dear Antonella, Thanks so much. No, I don’t need to morons. However it sounds like next session there will be a few less of them. Many hugs back to you
I agree with your other commenters, but especially want to echo what Julianne said. You have to do what’s right for you.
All of you are so smart and wise. Thanks, Lisa!
I always thought I’d get my PhD, but I quit school after a few months in graduate school. The ridiculousness of formal education finally got to me.
(Ironically, I have now worked in higher education for over a decade. Love the atmosphere of learning, hate bad teachers and outdated academic practices.)
Before that, I’d wanted to quit a few times. The times I decided to stay, I asked myself “what is in this for me? Will it affect my career opportunities? Do I need this course credit or this idiot’s recommendation for college/classes I want to attend later?” There were times I had to remind myself constantly about what was in it for ME, whether or not I respected the instructor.
Also, (and, working at a university, I’ve seen this process more than a few times)– I think that, among people who love school and learning, there comes a time when you just can no longer buy into the system of homework/grades/tests/degree plans and the occasional bad teacher. And then you know you are done getting degrees.
I think the decision to quit is a very individual thing. Life is short and I think sometimes people “hang in there” too long for fear of being a quittter. On the other hand, if you stand to benefit from this program as a whole, it might be worth it to find a way to work around the bad parts.
Dear Ms. M. I so appreciate you sharing a bit about your journey. I can tell you that for sure I would be out of here if there were homework/grades/tests. This is just reading and lecture. Two of the lecturers have been fantastic. Two have not. 50-50 isn’t the worst of odds.;-)
I think you are so right about the quitting. If I stay or go it really shouldn’t be about staying so as to avoid being a quitter. If I stay it should be because I want to.
Thanks again!
P.S. Although I’m critical of “the ridiculousness of formal education”, I totally get the desire for a structured learning environment to help us get through our studies. I just wish we could do it without the crappy aspects of academia.
I also wish we could have it without the egos. The egos of academia really need to go!;-)
The purse/bag or the certificate? My top-of-the-head answer would be the purse. More appealing to carry around too as compared to the other. The certificate, on the other hand, is ego-boosting (not saying you’ll be an egotistical person but a morale lift kind-of-way) and a proof of millions of challenges dealt and goals accomplished. Have your eyes on the prize, leaving doesn’t mean quitting. Taking a different path to get to where you wanna be shows that you CAN be creative, ARE brave to improvise and WILL proof them wrong in their assumption.
Of course whatever you decide to go with in the end, I’ll be by your side.
xoxoxo
And there is a GORGEOUS chestnut leather Prada bag that I have my eye on. But, yeah, the certificate would be good to have and the knowledge I would gain in the program is more of a boost than any bag could be.
I so appreciate your, and other peoples, affirmation that leaving doesn’t mean quitting. I know it intellectually and yet it is something I clearly need to be reminded of.
Happy to have you by my side!xoxoxo
Do what you feel is right. You shouldn’t have to look for validation of your decisions from anyone, you know what feels good in your bones. Good luck!
As a personal fyi, I have dropped classes and replaced classes about a dozen times during my undergrad. Why learn in a fearful environment when you can learn in a wonderful one?
Thank you, Gillian. I so appreciate you adding your voice to the discussion. I do think I am in process of coming to the answer. Tomorrow I have the last class of the quarter. Perhaps that will clarify that for me.
My mother brought up my quitting piano lessons for years and years during my childhood … the teacher was a scary bully and when my mother finally overheard the woman abusing my younger sister, she fired her.
I still remember that piano teacher’s name.
What is it with parents and their instruments?;-)
If you decide to stay with it, I think you have to do so knowing that it will continue to be a very mixed bag. It is what it is and all that.
Yeah, I know you are right. And usually I find the bad/maddening to be interesting and educational. I think I have just been surprised by the level of the reaction I got( the one in Monday’s post).
As far as I can tell, a Supervisor is supposed to be like a mentor, whilst having some of the characteristics of a boss. And having an unsupportive boss that you don’t like/respect is the worst thing that can happen.
This isnt “a job” for you this is a vocation therefore I would imagine the significance of the issue is amplified tenfold. Then again, would it ultimately be a helpful/growing experience to make yourself work with someone you dislike? Are you going to turn away every client you dislike? Do you *need* to have a supervisor who likes you?
Is this an opinion that Igor has of this supervisor because of his own experience? Do you trust Igor implicitly or is it worth experiencing this guy for yourself?
So many questions. None of them very helpful…
Whatever your decision, as others have said, only you know what is right for you.
Should you decide to go ahead with a mean-ass supervisor, be sure that the entire interweb will be with you every step of the way ready to say “boo” and “hiss” throughout his mean-ass-ness.
Hmm I seem to have written a novel. I only wanted to say that Spotify started playing this song as I landed on your blog which freaked me out somewhat.
Best of luck ma petite Belette. I look forward to hearing your decision.
WG.x
You, my friend, ask some very interesting and thought provoking questions. Igor worked with this supervisor for two years. He describes this supervisor as religious in his devotion to a certain theorist( the supervisor has a near fanatical devotion to his theorist of choice and he has no capacity, from what I hear, to see any other way of working as valuable). I do trust Igor implicitly, because Igor and I tend to have almost identical reactions about peers/teachers/and therapists we know in common. That doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t be worthwhile, interesting, or, at the very least, post-inspiring to work with Mr. Mean.
I like your novel and I like how you got me thinking.
Seriously? Spotify played the Clash??? What a synchronicity!
Thanks again!xo
Wow – your instructors are making lawyers look kind and well-behaved, which is a real feat! Do you think that some of these folks were attracted to the mental health field because they so obviously have issues of their own – and/or wanted a captive pool of victims (for their bad behavior)?
Do what is best for you – I don’t know if what you’d get at the end of enduring this is worth it (or if you could get that end product in another way) but I agree that we all only live once, and this kind of BS is unnecessary.
Oh, and the quitting…. None of my senior “very creative” and self-regarding relations ever finished anything. All musical instruments set aside when they because boring, all paintings, stories and sewing projects dropped when they got hard or boring….and then I refused to continue with violin lessons after I went to college at age 16. Big drama – you don’t quit; quitters don’t win…blah blah blah. I agree with the career and coach bloggers – you HAVE TO quit some things in life to succeed. You quit the things that aren’t worth your time, or going in a productive direction, and focus on what is worthwhile.
Yeah, lots of therapists behave VERY badly. You should see the column in “the Therapist” which is a sort of Ink Blot of all the infractions and illegal things therapists do. It is a fascinating read and yet HIGHLY disturbing.
I signed up with the class because I wanted to learn more about post-Freudian theory. I do think this class will help me achieve that goal. There is no big career improvement goal in this. It is more journey than an end goal.
Thank you so much for sharing your violin drama. It seems that this is a common theme. And I totally love this line:” you HAVE TO quit some things in life to succeed. You quit the things that aren’t worth your time, or going in a productive direction, and focus on what is worthwhile.” Thank you!!!!
You can guess where I will land with this one: it isn’t “quitting”. You are making a choice *not* to pursue learning in an unhealthy environment. Seriously, a decision to better invest your time, energy and money energy seems more-than-healthy to me.
Are there other opportunities to take the class down the road, perhaps after the move?
Smiles at you Miss LBR,
tp
Thanks, lovely Princess. Le sigh to the idea of taking classes in Chicago. That would be a lovely option.
I’m going to answer this question as you formulated it ie. what would I do (not what do I think you should do)? I would stick it out; I would hope to continue learning from the experience, even the negative parts, and I would hope that my honest voiced appraisal of the course would make it a better experience for those who come after me and perhaps even make the course instructors better practitioners.
I appreciate your answering what you would do. It really helps to hear. And when I think about leaving it feels sort of sad and that I will lose something by going. I’d hate to lose out! And I do like to imagine that my presence might change things. Thanks so much, Lesley!
I wish I were as smart as the people above. I think all of their points are good and valid. I don’t know anything about psychology and would never pretend to, I like leaving that to the experts. My education is in business and French. I can only give you an opinion from my life experiences. With all that aside I will say to you to soldier on. These people have shown their agendas of jealousy and unprofessionalism but they are teaching a class that for you is a means to an end and that is your certification that you value (way more valued than a Prada bag!). You have no control over who the school hires so you are somewhat at their mercy with instructors. You are a smart educated woman and are probably bringing knowledge that other students are benefitting from. You are bringing good things to that class and quitting that class is denying the others as well as yourself. I believe you can go into this class knowing there is incompetence. Whenever I face adversity I try to make a note of it and it prepares me to face further adversity. I say go into that class knowing what you may face but soon the class will be over and you never have to see them again but you will be certified and a stronger person. I went to college as a returning student and I got plenty of adversity from many professors because I was an older student. They wanted the young ones that hung on every word they said. I questioned them and they didn’t like it and some made my life miserable for the semester but I hung in because I wanted my degree. I even had one professor that told me I needed a note from my husband and I told him he could go eff himself! I got an A in his class but he sure didn’t like me and showed his disdain to the whole class. It made me stronger and I think staying in that class with those assholes will make you stronger too. In the end you will do what is best for you and don’t be hard on yourself for whatever decision you make.
Thanks so much, Linda. I so appreciate you sharing your reaction. I will admit that I am in a bit of a selfish mode and don’t really feel motivated about how my absence will benefit others. But I do like thinking that maybe my evals will change who they use for future classes. I think if I was going for the *certificate* and not for the experience that the answer would feel more clear cut. Since I am not it is less so.
I can’t believe the NERVE of your instructor to ask for a note from your husband. OUTRAGEOUS!! I so admire you hanging in there. Well done!!! You are a strong woman.
Thanks again, Linda!
I love learning, but I hate schooling…
I think the option of buying your own super is the best one… And don’t worry… We can keep you motivated if needed…
Oh and you should never consider changing paths quitting… It’s just that… Changing paths… (No matter what your dad or my dad or any other dad have/had to say about it…;))
Loads of love! XXX
I know you can keep me motivated! I am lucky to have such wonderful friends.
To heck with Dads! I am so helped by hearing this so much. It is so true,changing paths is not quitting.
Loads of love to you too!xoxo
Hmmm.
My two cents: keep going.
Maybe they’ll learn something from *you,* right? I bet they will!
XO
A.
I wish I could do both… I wish I could quit and keep going. I want it all and I want it all now.;-)
xo
Sucky situation LBR…I would stick with it only if it was short term, one or two classes, especially if I needed to have those classes. I would change (not quit) if this was going to be long term, how many classes do you have to endure with the ‘envious-amnesiacs’?
xoxo
Impressed with Igor
My advisor once told me to not make things too painful for myself, not worth it, but not to give up at the slightest incidence either…where does one draw the line?
The class is divided into three trimesters. I am done with the first one. The second one starts in January. I would have only 5 weeks of the “bad supervisor”. Whatchya think? What would your advisor say?
Igor is an impressive guy!
xoxo
Oh, I understand the need for structured learning in spite of the problematic professor(s). What got me through those soul-scouring classes in grad school were some of the other students who acted as a “council of peers.” These folks were in the program or in the class, and we debriefed each other periodically. We were allies rather than friends–never socialized otherwise–but because we sensed that we would all act in good faith we could, together, make something good out of the worst classes even if we disagreed vehemently about the concepts. Thirty years later I’m still in touch with some of them, and they still give me good advice.
I envy that council of peers that you describe. Not really happening in my class. If it was I think I would feel less alone in this. There are a couple of peers who seem to be struggling with the instructors. And just knowing that does help a little. I somehow doubt that I will stay in contact with anyone in this class and that is disappointing too.
I’m with Mona that I would stick with this if it were short term, if there was an ending in sight.
The good news is…if you stay, and it is horrible, you can always choose to stop the program at that time.
For myself, I have an unfortunate way of canceling myself from experiences that could be unpleasant…I am trying NOT to do this, because in the past I have learned so much from these times.
A bad teacher can teach us lots of lessons, right? I find that for myself, I just like to have the option of deciding after assessing all circumstances (I always go to job interviews, for example, even if I don’t want the job).
Again, that is me in your leopard print cute shoes.
Whatever decision you make, it will be the right one!
xoxoxo
Is 5 weeks of the bad supervisor short term? I have lost sense of time. I guess I can do anything for five weeks.;-)
I love how you languaged this “I have an unfortunate way of canceling myself from experiences that could be unpleasant.” Yeah, I do agree. I too learn a lot from these experiences. Gosh, I have learned so much just from these two posts and hearing all of your and everyone’s feedback.
You look really cute in my leopard print shoes!xoxo
If I was in your Tory Burch leopard pumps, I would never want to know what the hell I did the previous evening. But since you asked for advice, I have to second what Hannah just typed. If it becomes *that* awful, would saying sayonara lead to any repercussions personally and/or professionally other than ‘whew’ and a lighter pocketbook?
Experiencing yokelry can be beneficial (man, some of these people have issues; anyone know a good psychoanalyst?) but there are limits to one’s sanity.
I would LOVE to hear the story of how you got into my shoes. Huh, that would be a great movie idea? Huh? Kind of like the Hangover. Think how rich you would be??? Come on, you know you want to write a screenplay about how you got into leopard pumps. And you will of course want to share the royalties with me. Won’t you?
No, there would be no professional repercussions. None at all. But, yeah, I am thinking that the yolkerly might be personally and creatively inspirational. And, seriously, these people REALLY could use a good therapist. But where to find one???
I tried what you are doing and came to the same kind of place where I was spending a lot of money and ending up not getting enough of value. So I took the route of doing the reading on my own and finding and working with the best supervisor I could find. It was a great experience and I learned a lot. Then after three years, I found another great supervisor. This has been an enormously fruitful way for me to learn.
Thanks to this class I have learned several things:
1) I can step up and confront authority figures.
2) Just because someone is an analyst doesn’t mean that they know more than I do.
3) A whole lot about Klein and Bion.
4) More about Freud.
5) And must importantly I have found a woman who I would like to have as my supervisor.
I guess that’s not bad for $650.;-)
So happy you found such great supervisors. I had a GREAT teacher in grad school and she told me that the most important decision you make as a clinician is who you choose as a supervisor and that is soooooo true.
Ima ask my brudder.
Please do!:-)
If you decide to not go next quarter, you are far from a quitter. You are making the decision that is best for you – mentally and emotionally. Sometimes not doing something makes us happier than forcing ourselves to do something just to get through it. I know you will figure out what is best for you and what will make you the happiest in this scenario. Good luck! You are a strong, smart woman and deserve the best.
Thank you , Nicole. You are a sweetheart. I know you are right and yet it means a lot to hear it from friends. Thanks so much for all your kind words!!:-)
The problem is really that you already kind of know everything and if you don’t you can learn it on your own, so the only reason to stay is if you feel that you need the certificate or whatever it is for whatever reason… also the interaction with others keeps you on your toes and makes you look at your own stuff, speaking up when necessary, being heard and told that you are RIGHT is worth it… in the end it does not really matter if you stay or go as long as you enjoy it… life is way too short to do something that does not bring you joy, and as you know, most therapists and psych students have a lot of issues as we all do… and it is always intense and filled with drama! So just follow your heart.. ask why you are doing this.. is it somehow for IGOR perhaps?
Trust me, dear friend, I know FAR from everything. But you are always such a wonderful cheerleader and I somehow have tricked you into thinking that I do and I am not going to try and disabuse you of this.;-P, I don’t *need* the certificate. I just wanted more depth of learning about psychoanalysis. And, yeah, I totally agree with you. I will learn a lot even if it isn’t the ideal. I, as you know, love to learn. Igor doesn’t give a fig if I do the course or not. He does know how much I love to learn and he thinks I will ultimately learn a lot from the whole course. I am sure I will too.
Hmmm…I’m a big fan of following your gut. Do you have an overall feeling of what’s best for you? Will you ever have to take another class with those two instructors? If it were me, I’d have to take a look at how important psychoanalytic certification is to me personally. Does it carry the same weight as having your book published?
I think it’s incredibly sad that you even have to make this decision. Sending lots of hugs and positive energy your way.
I still feel mixed. I know I don’t want more of the memory phobic twins. And I will not have to have them again. It is all new instructors the next trimester. I love learning theory but it definitely does not carry the same weight as book publication. One is more process and the other more end goal. Very different and yet both important.
Thanks for the wonderful food for thought. And, yeah, it does feel sad. Thanks, Zen!
There will always, ALWAYS be aspects of things we must do to improve ourselves that we do not like. AS much as Miss J LOVES her improv group, boy sometimes she doesn’t want to go to rehearsal or she is sick of so&so’s attitude. In the long run, its worth it to stay because Miss J has the long term goal of improving her work. “Quitting” won’t make LA B a quitter- clearly La B isn’t a quitter. But La B might regret not sticking it out through the BS so she can achieve the goal she set.
I can so tell you know the pain of the process in order to get what you want. And I so admire you sticking it out. I am, more and more, as I read everyones comments and I think about them and discover how I feel, thinking that sticking it out is likely what I will do. Will keep you posted! Thanks, Miss Janey!
I am going to respond to all of your comments individually later tonight but I just HAD to tell you all how much your thoughtful comments mean to me. I feel so grateful to have such BRILLIANT bloggy friends. I am still not sure what I am going to do. But I can tell you that I feel much better about either decision. Thank you so much. You just don’t know how much it means to me that your incredibly generous, thoughtful and supportive comments. You all have me thinking and rethinking. And I can tell you that the way you responded to my plea for help touches me so much that this dilemma is dwarfed by how lucky I feel to have such wonderful blog friends. Thank you!!!! Thank you so much!xoxoox
Leaving your parents and the old news about quitting out of it, my impression is that according to Igor you have a ⅔ chance of really enjoying and getting a lot out of the next session. That seems like pretty good odds to me. If it turns out you really have a problem with the supervisor, you could always either just carry on or hire someone to help if you must.
I have confidence in you.
2/3 is really pretty good. Susan, thank you. I appreciate your reminder of those percentages. And, yeah, I could skip out on the supervision if it is horrible. Thank you. You really helped.
I so appreciate your friendship and your confidence.
I always seem to hate about 1/3 of what I have to do/put up with in a job, class, or experience, so enjoying 2/3 to get to an end goal seems about right, ha!
I also think learning in a group environment can prove to be everything from enlightening to a PITA. [Some of my best work has come from bouncing ideas off of -- or collaborating with -- a peer. Some of my worst, too!]
I’m not sure if it’s been a while since you were in a group learning setting vs doing primarily self-directed learning, but if so staying with the program may give you extra insights to helping your clients who are dealing with organizational/interpersonal dynamics. [<-- silver lining]
That said, I'm sure hiring your own supervisor and learning at your own pace would be extremely rewarding in its own way.
I'd probably go with whatever seems most appealing. Just because a choice is the "easy" one doesn't mean it's the WRONG one!
The hard numbers are really helping me. And, as you so wisely say, 1/3 of almost everything is unpleasant. It isn’t a bad ratio.
Yeah, it has been about 6 years since I have been in school. I do find that I am MUCH more motivated to read and to integrate the learning when I am in a group setting. And, yeah, those group dynamic issues are VERY fresh in my mind at the moment. I hadn’t even thought of that. You are brilliant.
I might do a combo platter. I might do the class and individual supervision. That might be the best of both worlds. Hmmm….
Thank you, Brilliant Vix!!
I am less brilliant than full of Ulterior Motives, ha!
But you do seem like someone who really thrives (emotionally and intellectually from positive group interactions), so if you can handle the probable/potential negative ones I think you’ll come out ahead.
I like the combo platter idea for you…a LOT.
Again my comments come with the caveat that I am not a card-carrying member of the shawl-wearing brigade! But I’ve long been surprised (alarmed?) with the relatively insightless ‘need to be right’ and almost gleeful squashing of students and junior staff members some psychodynamic and psychoanalytic colleagues engage in. I mean seriously guys … we’re all muddling along doing the best we can with vague constructs and imprecise tools … being an asshole isn’t going to fool anyone into thinking you’re infallible. If they refuse to play nice I think it’s totally advisable to take your toys and leave the sandpit. But if you decide to stay I think you’ll be a tonic for them and the programme.
It’s funny but I could, by your description call Kitty a ‘quitter’ but strangely I have never seen her like that, instead she has to me been a child who knew her mind and had from an early age an ability to know what she found entertaining and what bored her. I am sure many, many sportsman and musicians would disagree with her attitude, living by the mantra no pain no gain, BUT you could equally argue that the rewards rarely if ever justify the pain and in fact why not live a consistently happy life instead of a life with more troughs than peaks?
Concerning your classes, I speak as a teacher. It is often said that those than can’t ‘do’ teach, well in a sense it is true because what we can ‘do’ IS teach, teaching is a skill in it’s self, it is not enough to have knowledge what is needed is the skill to facilitate the transfer of knowledge in a way that the student becomes empowered and confident when acquiring new skills. Your teachers’ maybe experts but they can’t teach and in effect have become very negative facilitators. It is possible to still take something from them but sometimes the lack of respect you will have for them may get in the way of your learning.
Sadly only you can decide.
I realised much of this when studying painting this year, the teachers knew their stuff but I was horrified at their inability to convey the simplest of theories, luckily I was able to take from them what I needed, but a younger student would have really struggled. Good luck
Coming late to the commentary, but after I read the second comment (by the Pliers) I realized I have nothing to add. Her (his) questions are exactly the right ones. I especially like how s/he reframed it from being about quitting and enjoyment to goals. That de-sensitizes the whole thing. I look forward to reading all the comments more carefully taking away other incredibly useful ideas. The hanger metaphor is one I’ve been looking for my whole career! More school always seemed like the answer.
Such a tribute to you, dear, that you hang out in the blog space with such cool, smart people (I don’t mean me, but I don’t not mean me, either.)
One thing I know for sure is that whatever you decide/decided, it will be the right thing.
oh boy i was holding my breath reading this one! i am getting such a vicarious thrill from you speaking/emailing your mind to this b@st@rd.
making me think about my intense lack of motivation when it comes to myself and my own projects (even though i can aggressively coach and encourage any of my friends) and the ‘quitter’ label ringing in my ears – same voice that produced yours. it looks like yours didn’t stick though! that is a beautiful list of things you’ve accomplished. hooray.